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death loop survival
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Post new topic   Reply to topic    Northwest Kiteboarding -> Gorge / Portland / Oregon Coast
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pauls

Since 20 Jun 2005
520 Posts
Portland
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PostThu Jan 07, 16 6:17 pm    death loop survival Reply with quote

Something to think about. Lots of comments on Youtube

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=naFKEWEHn6k

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bobgatpdx

Since 04 Oct 2008
173 Posts

Stoked



PostThu Jan 07, 16 8:26 pm     Reply with quote

I thought this was a very useful piece. It's good to practice (or at least think about) sketchy situations that could get you into trouble.
- Bob

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Windian

Since 28 Apr 2008
732 Posts
Newport, OR
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PostThu Jan 07, 16 8:34 pm     Reply with quote

Good video post. Thanks!

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ErraticAKn

Since 08 Jul 2011
528 Posts

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PostFri Jan 08, 16 6:34 am     Reply with quote

Not a bad idea to practice recovery methods like this, especially if you have the opportunity to see how it feels and go through scenarios in light winds.

In higher wind velocities lines will become tighter and harder to grab hold of and manipulate, as well the kite has the potential to spiral wickedly fast. You may not have much time to think about what is happening or how to mitigate it.

I employ spirals and loops for climbing when snowkiting or downwinders, but from several ridiculous experiences - death spirals scare the #$%^& outta me.

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bigjohn

Since 13 Mar 2012
296 Posts

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PostFri Jan 08, 16 9:32 am     Reply with quote

Thumb's Up Thumb's Up Thumb's Up

Best kite safety video ever.

As Kiters we are taught to rely on our kite's safety systems. In reality some/often times pulling a safety can put us (or others around us) in a more dangerous situation. Especially if this safety pulled is your second safety releasing your kite to flow freely into others down wind!!!

Your steering lines are you friend. Take the time to learn how to use them. I especially like the video's section regarding the act of practicing access to your steering lines when your bar is garbled. I have personally experienced a situation where I rode through my lines and wrapped a knot around my harness. Luckily I was in the water as it took me a good 45 seconds to figure out how to access a steering line to flag my kite. If I had been on land I suspect the situation would have been bad.

I am personally going to practice the techniques shown in the video for accessing my bar's steering lines and encourage others to do so as well.

Another concept to consider if your gear is garbled is pulling yourself up your lines to access a point where your steering lines are free such that you can flag your kite. This would obviously be a last case option, but if you can't slide a steering line due to a knot or fixed object between you and your kite it might be an option to consider.

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Last edited by bigjohn on Fri Jan 08, 16 9:48 am; edited 1 time in total

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dude abides

Since 06 Apr 2014
45 Posts
Bend, OR
 



PostFri Jan 08, 16 9:38 am    worth watching Reply with quote

thanks for posting.
Mike

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kss

Since 24 Apr 2006
577 Posts
pdx
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PostFri Jan 08, 16 10:06 am     Reply with quote

good find paul!! Thumb's Up gonna have ashton go through this video a bunch. good for groms and OGs alike!!

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SpaceRacer

Since 04 Nov 2007
408 Posts

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PostSat Jan 09, 16 10:02 pm     Reply with quote

I have seen this video and give thanks to who made it. But I am skeptical of whether this would work, especially in the Gorge on small powered kites. If you watch the video, despite being in super light wind, this guy's kite tries to relaunch itself. If you're on a looping kite, most likely one outside line is shorter than the other. As you reel in the longer line, you then end up with two equal length steering lines that are both shorter than the center lines, tipping the kite back to either relaunch or hot launch. And good luck in deep water trying to fly a kite with one hand wrapped around a steering line while you "calmly sort your junk out". In a death spiral, I'm reaching for my big hook knife and cutting my center lines and every other f+×÷ing thing with tension on it.

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Alz

Since 04 Aug 2015
16 Posts

 



PostFri Apr 22, 16 7:40 pm     Reply with quote

I was at Cape Hatteras last week, on a 7m kite (other kiters were on 6-8 m kites). The wind was blowing about 28 with gusts into the mid 30s. During a particularly strong gust, I was having trouble keeping control when things went bad, and I hit the water. I expected the kite to calm down, but this time it kept dragging me while it kept looping. I've been kiting less than a year, so it took me a little longer than it should have to realize what was happening and I was slow to release the chicken loop. The loop released, but there were enough twists in the lines to keep the kite from depowering much. I was in waist deep water, but couldn't stand up.

We had watched the video the night before, so it was fresh in my mind. What I should have done the second I realized the kite was still looping, was RELEASE THE SAFETY LEASH Exclamation , but I was thinking about the video.

I had to pull myself about 10 feet up the lines to get ahead of the twists, then I started pulling on one of the lines. It took about another 6 feet of pulling before the kite calmed down, but it worked. Being in shallow water was definitely helpful. So the technique in the video works. But I think it should stressed that if you can release the kite, do that before trying to get to a single line. It is too easy to get tangled in the lines. I think I'd use a hook knife too before trying the maneuver.

It turned out the initial problem that caused the kite to loop was one of the center lines broke.

Alan

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bulae99

Since 12 Jul 2006
1691 Posts

I give out bad advice.



PostFri Apr 22, 16 7:52 pm    omg Reply with quote

wow

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daveS

Since 23 Jul 2007
70 Posts

 



PostMon Apr 25, 16 7:11 am     Reply with quote

I think the most helpful thing I learned after watching the video and reading comments was to STOP attaching my leash to the back of my harness. I don't do handle bar passes. I even think its a bad idea to sell harnesses with the back attachment already set up. Make it an option for wake style riders to add IMO.

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patdaniels

Since 29 Jul 2015
71 Posts
Seattle area
 



PostMon Apr 25, 16 7:24 am     Reply with quote

Don't forget back attachment on harnesses also serves for assisted hold down while launching sketchy, or for holding down while teaching kiters, so the harness manufacturers will probably keep back attachment on there. You are right though, it's safer to attach to the front. I've also gone to a shorter leash to help avoid a neck wrap crashing in surf and getting tumbled.

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moondog

Since 15 Aug 2007
390 Posts
white salmon
Obsessed

CGKA Member


PostMon Apr 25, 16 7:44 am     Reply with quote

Great video, thanks for sharing. We just about lost a kiter last year in the Gorge because of the death spiral scenario. Afterwards he shared he was just seconds from drowning before he cut his lines. I will share this technique as soon as I see him this season.
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deminimis

Since 15 Jul 2014
263 Posts
On the Rocks
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PostMon Apr 25, 16 11:40 am     Reply with quote

Good find. Thanks. The Boy could have used this technique last Summer when he snapped a center line at Floras.

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Alz

Since 04 Aug 2015
16 Posts

 



PostMon Apr 25, 16 12:11 pm     Reply with quote

It's a good technique to know, but if I can release the chicken loop and the safety release and ditch the kite, it's safer than trying to get to a single line. The risk is getting tangled up in the other lines and having the kite relaunch.

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bigjohn

Since 13 Mar 2012
296 Posts

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PostTue May 23, 17 8:07 pm    Part 2 to the video Reply with quote

I came across an update to the original video. I found it to be informative as well.

Situations for cutting lines are addressed. Death loop in high winds are addressed. A well put together safety video.

Check out:

https://youtu.be/SjA5CEzZrTU?t=14

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FreerideWhiteSalmon

Since 17 May 2012
45 Posts

 

CGKA Member


PostWed May 24, 17 10:48 am     Reply with quote

SpaceRacer wrote:
I have seen this video and give thanks to who made it. But I am skeptical of whether this would work, especially in the Gorge on small powered kites. If you watch the video, despite being in super light wind, this guy's kite tries to relaunch itself. If you're on a looping kite, most likely one outside line is shorter than the other. As you reel in the longer line, you then end up with two equal length steering lines that are both shorter than the center lines, tipping the kite back to either relaunch or hot launch. And good luck in deep water trying to fly a kite with one hand wrapped around a steering line while you "calmly sort your junk out". In a death spiral, I'm reaching for my big hook knife and cutting my center lines and every other f+×÷ing thing with tension on it.


Is there a reason you wouldn't just pop your second safety and release the kite at this point, vs. cutting lines? The only situation I can think of is the bar is somehow tangled and attached to your harness on the hook.

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